Words of Advice:

"If Something Seems To Be Too Good To Be True, It's Best To Shoot It, Just In Case." -- Fiona Glenanne

"Foreign Relations Boil Down to Two Things: Talking With People or Killing Them." -- Unknown

"Mobs Do Not Rush Across Town to Do Good Deeds." -- James Lee Burke

"Colt .45s; putting bad guys underground since 1873." -- Unknown

"Stay Strapped or Get Clapped." -- probably not Mr. Rogers

"Let’s eat all of these people!” — Venom

"Eck!" -- George the Cat

Sunday, April 19, 2020

Not Just the Flu

During flu season, one doesn't see reefer trucks parked outside of hospitals to serve as temporary morgues.

You're going to see a lot of the low-wattage crowd bleating: "See, only 50,000 people died! It's just like the flu."

Which is, of course, bullshit. 50,000 dead is with many states shutting down for a month or more. 50,000 dead is with people practicing social distancing and foregoing air travel. Many of those 50,000 would be alive today if Our Toddler-in-Chief had listened to scientists instead of right-wing pundits. Many of them would be alive if Trump cared about people instead of the Dow Jones Industrial Average.

Go read any of these posts. Or go read this or this.

Right-wing induced ignorance has its cost. This guy probably didn't have to die. Many more are going to die if we listed to Trump's Army of Covid-19 Surrender Monkeys.


B said...

You gonna denigrate all those who protested when he did close the travel, etc?

Lots of those were left wingers on your side.

Could it have been handled better? Yes.
But really, you've jumped the shark here.

DTWND said...

B, do you purposely attempt to be contrarian? Would it help if we 'praise' Trump for closing the travel? When in reality, the loopholes in his travel restrictions were numerous. For example, Chinese visitors could not come into the country. Except American citizens could come back home. And Chinese goods could come in. And people who were in China could come in if they first went to another country.
And the European restriction said you couldn't come to the US. Except for Great Britain. And another country that currently escapes my mind (hey, I'm old). And then a couple of days later, you couldn't.

In nearly every single post about Covid-19 you say is not the flu, and later in the same post you claim its no worse than the flu. You decry the steps taken by the governors based upon the Trump created Corona Virus Task Force, and the next sentence you say that social distancing, mask wearing, and isolation is making a dent in the numbers of cases. You advise your opponents to use numbers from reliable sources and recommend Johns Hopkins Coronavirus site. And then when the do, using your own numbers, you flip again and claim that they are not looking at the data in the correct manner.

Dude, protest all you want. Debate whatever side you want. But be consistent. Aside from always coming to the defense of Trump, you flip so often, one would think you're part pancake.


B said...

I have said that distancing is a good idea. Should be done for ALL airborne(ish) diseases, like covid, like flu.

I also said that people entering the country from anywhere should be subject to a 21 day quarantine during the Wu-flu crisis.

You wanna talk consistency? Your side said that the travel restrictions were a bad idea. Your side wanted to keep interactions with chinese people "normal" because racism and shut up. Pretty much wanted things kept as normal.

Your folks want to treat every place in the US like New York.

Your folks blame trump, and while he does deserve some of it, he listened to the WHO and the CDC when they said not to worry. You can't seem to apply the same standards to Cuomo or DiBlasio. Many of those 14,000 are dead because they didn't stop the mass transit. They didn't do anything until it became a big deal, then they cried out for Federal help and STILL didn't stop the busses and trains...or even make people "Distance" themselves on the mass transit.

Here is a hint: If you take the greater NYC area out of the numbers for the US we are ranked 15th is deaths per million in the world. NYC is number two at the time of writing if you classify them as their own country.

The rest of the US is fairly safe, statistically. But that must be the fault of the Donald....

14,000 deaths in a city of 12 million. the rest of the US, even other large cities, don't even come close to that number.

But keep on with those double standards.

DTWND said...

News Flash. NYC is part of the United States of America.

My side? I'll take the CDC on my side. Umm. Trump himself didn't want to issue travel restrictions until he was pressured into it.
"The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention on Jan. 21 announced the first travel-related case of novel coronavirus in the United States. Trump unveiled his plan 10 days later, making the restrictions effective Feb. 2." Even after Trump issued his travel ban plan, 40,00 individuals entered the country in the two moths following 'the ban.'

Apply the same standards to Cuomo? Not only he, but governors across the country followed the guidelines set out by TRUMP'S Coronavirus Task Force. Those same guidelines that TRUMP is now inciting revolt against by tweeting "Liberate ."

NYC is not Northern Indiana. There are less cars per person in New York. The most feasible method of moving people is via bus or subway. Just how do you propose getting those doctors, nurses, orderlies, maintenance workers, cleaners, cooks, etc. to the hospitals?

The rest of the US safe? For someone who claims to know statistics, that is a bold claim. How do you explain SFO, DTW, ATL, PHL, BOS, MSY, HOU, and others? And spare me the 'every death is attributed to Corona' drivel that Fox News and the right are spewing.
Death rates of 2.5% in Texas, 2.9% in Florida, 3.1% in Missouri, 3.7% in Maryland and California, 4.3% in Colorado, 5% in Indiana, 5.5 % in Louisiana, 5.7% in New York State, 6.1% in Connecticut, 7.6% in Michigan. Nationwide, a death rate of 4.6%. You call that safe? These are the John Hopkins numbers as of midnight 4/20, numbers you quote so often.

Yes the economy is failing with the state wide lockdowns. But is the stock market the only barometer we should use to end the social distancing? The right is mostly concerned that Trump's approval rating will fall, thereby hurting his chances for re-election.

Rural America can be released, provided they remain outside of urban areas? Cities can open up provided they remain within their own city limits? How you gonna do that? These 'spontaneous' protests that are springing up in the state capitals are fed by the right, conservatives, Trump's toadies, and Trump himself. The largest one, as far as I know, was here in Lansing. People bringing their children, not wearing masks or gloves, handing out candy to kids, standing much closer together than 6 feet. Gambling their lives, and their children's, that they're not going to get the virus.

This disease is not Donald Trump's fault. The nation's mis-handling of the response IS. His double messages are. Going against his own expert's advice is his fault. He wants to get re-elected? Then assume the mantel of leadership, act presidential, provide a united message to all the states, and work to end this pandemic prior to returning to business as usual. Once we have this disease under control, then we can discuss what was done correctly and where the national leadership failed.


dinthebeast said...

Pull a shift as a janitor in any nursing home in the US and then we'll talk about when it's safe to relax the restrictions and where.

-Doug in Sugar Pine

CenterPuke88 said...

B., he closed travel to non-residents who had visited China in the last 14 days, on Jan 31st, a couple of months after the first warnings were delivered to him...and then the virus entered the U.S., in New York, from Europe....whoops. Talk about shutting the barn door after...

The U.S. has 4% of the world population and 30% of the COVID-19 cases, hell of a job, Donnie!

Comrade, 50,000 death toll is long gone, we’re already through 40,500. With Florida doing what it is, expect a nice spike there, with a pretty heavy death percentage due to the older population. If you’ve noticed what it’s doing to meat-packing, keep your eye on that.

B said...

SO we have to lock down the country because people will spread the disease.

But not in New York because they need to move around.

Can't close the Subways because people that are supposed to stay home meed to move around, even though they should stay home.

New York is special, not like the rest of the country.

When ridership decreases in the subways, we cut service because the efficiency....when less crowded cars are a GOOD IDEA.
Even though NY is an outlier as to cases per million, we still need to treat the rest of the country like New York because things are the same even though New York is different.

Crowding people together is bad but the Subways and Busses are special because New York needs them to continue as normal even though things aren't normal, and even though everyone should stay home New Yorkers need to move around even though it is killing them at a greater rate than the rest of the country.

Did I get your argument right there?

DTWND said...

Nope. But you get a gold star for trying to spin the facts to your side. NYC is under a stay indoors order just like other cities. Citizens of other cities leave their homes to get groceries, prescriptions, checking on the welfare of the elderly, etc. by driving cars. Those in NYC however, don't have cars. They have to use public transportation to run those necessary actions. Or would you rather that them dang librels jus die already.

B, you're arguments are weak and making you look like a fool. It's your prerogative to watch Hannity, Dobbs, and Ingram; and listen to Levin and Limbaugh and Jones. But when you attempt to use their talking points and twist them to fit 'your' viewpoint it just doesn't work.


Pete said...

The subways and busses haven't continued as normal.
I saw a blurb last night where ridership is down 93% for
the month of April. IIRC, by mid-March it was down 80-85%,
so the subways and busses are not packed.

I would also suggest that not everyone in the NYC metro area
lives only 1-2 blocks away from grocery stores or even bodegas.


0_0 said...

From the linked NYT article:

A spokeswoman for Fox News said that Mr. Hannity made statements taking the spread of coronavirus seriously early on, and that his comment about the public being scared by the coverage happened after the Joyces had left on their cruise...

...Early in March Sean Hannity went on air proclaiming that he didn’t like the way that the American people were getting scared “unnecessarily.’’ He saw it all, he said, “as like, let’s bludgeon Trump with this new hoax.”

"Early in March" was March 7.

Ginia Bellafante, author of the NYT articles, posted on 27 Feb.:
I fundamentally don't understand the panic: incidence of the disease is declining in China. Virus is not deadly in vast majority of cases. Production and so on will slow down and will obviously rebound. cc: @opinion_joe

— Ginia Bellafante (@GiniaNYT) February 27, 2020