Seen on the street in Kyiv.

Words of Advice:

"If Something Seems To Be Too Good To Be True, It's Best To Shoot It, Just In Case." -- Fiona Glenanne

“The Mob takes the Fifth. If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -- The TOFF *

"Foreign Relations Boil Down to Two Things: Talking With People or Killing Them." -- Unknown

“Speed is a poor substitute for accuracy.” -- Real, no-shit, fortune from a fortune cookie

"If you believe that you are talking to G-d, you can justify anything.” — my Dad

"Colt .45s; putting bad guys in the ground since 1873." -- Unknown

"Stay Strapped or Get Clapped." -- probably not Mr. Rogers

"The Dildo of Karma rarely comes lubed." -- Unknown

"Eck!" -- George the Cat

* "TOFF" = Treasonous Orange Fat Fuck, A/K/A Dolt-45,
A/K/A Commandante (or Cadet) Bone Spurs,
A/K/A El Caudillo de Mar-a-Lago, A/K/A the Asset., A/K/A P01135809

Friday, July 19, 2013

Ruminations on Guns, Self-Defense, Eric Holder and Assholes

Somebody once said: "An unknown situation with a gun is better than an unknown situation without one."

I think that's true. But here's the thing: Guns don't make you into Captain America or the Lone Ranger. As BadTux pointed out, if you go looking for trouble, trouble will find you. And if you're some self-important asshole, you'll find it, all right.

For all of the whinging of the pro-Zimmerman crowd that "his life is ruined", I say: "Tough shit." Zimmerman chose to to get into a confrontation with Martin, who wasn't doing anything wrong. Even if Martin didn't have a right to be where he was (which he most certainly did), the worst thing that he would have been doing is trespassing, which ranges from a violation to a misdemeanor, and is most certainly not something that you shoot somebody over. Zimmerman was a neighborhood watch volunteer. Their mission is to act as the eyes and ears of law enforcement, or to put it another way: To observe and report. They're not trained to make arrests, to get into fights or to use deadly force.

What Zimmerman should have done was stay in his car and keep watch. This is not even a close question.

As for the case itself-- This is an old saying: Bad cases make for bad laws. I am generally in favor of stand your ground laws. Things happen fast in real life, and what happens on the street in a half-second may not be fairly assessed two years later by a bunch of people munching pizza in an air-conditioned room. The "duty to retreat" in many states is meaningless, for it implies that you have to turn your back and outrun an attacker who probably is bigger, faster and younger than you are. If someone is bringing violence to you, it's pretty unreasonable to be legally required to have to run.

But I also think that the totality of the situation should matter, not merely uttering the magic incantation: "I was in fear for my life." And I also think that there is an argument to be made for putting the burden of proof, at least to the "more likely than not" standard, on the person asserting that they were justified in using deadly force.

There is something wrong with the idea that a person can pick a fight with another person, then say "fight's over", and if the other guy has the wind up in his sails and continues fighting, then the first guy, the one who started the fight, pulls out his heater and shoots the guy he attacked in the first place and tells the cops "I was in fear for my life", and the cops, in essence, have to respond: "Very good, sir. Here's your gun, would you prefer it if we have our armorer clean it for you?" That doesn't pass the fairness test.

I'm not criticizing the jury in the Zimmerman case. The law is what it is and their job was to look at the facts presented to them and judge them in accordance with the law, not what they'd wish the law was.

As to whether or not the case should have been brought, keep this in mind: In virtually every place I know of, the local district attorney (or prosecutor) is an elected official (or works for one). If there is a clamoring for a case to be brought (or a powerful patron pushing it), they're going to do that. The prosecutor in the Zimmerman case can now go to the voters and say: "hey, I tried, the facts weren't there for a conviction" and probably suffer nothing for it. If the prosecutor had made the call herself, then she might have suffered politically for it.

If there is one thing that politicians look out for, it's their own skins. And that applies to Attorney General Holder, as well.

5 comments:

Eck! said...

Like I said two asshats meet and can't for whatever reason back away.

A close contact brawl ensues and the guy with a gun has one option, shoot. Why shoot? Because if the other guy gets the gun he will shoot. It's self defense at that point.

The problem is the path to that event was so broken because neither could turn and walk.

It's neither right or wrong and from my perspective BOTH were wrong. But one was going to die no matter what. Because neither could disengage before they got to rock throwing distances.

The jury was right, it wasn't murder. However there is no laws regarding stupidity, if there were the prisons would be full.

Eck!

Tam said...

" Zimmerman chose to to get into a confrontation with Martin"

If you have evidence of that, the prosecutor sure could have used it.

The rest of your post equates to "She should have known what would happen if she wore that short skirt to a frat party."

I thought we were beyond that. Obviously not.

Keads said...

I teach in my state mandated concealed carry classes that going to the gun is the last option. Yes, I agree that many things went wrong, but at the end of the day I have to say +1 on Tam. She nailed it.

Eck! said...

Maybe someone should read Massad Ayoob on the subject.


Again I repeat, both had the option to turn and go in a direction that was further from the other. Think it out, there is no way either could get in the others face without both playing the same stupid game. I'm not even saying they were thinking or deliberate about it.


What happened after that is a matter of court testimony and forensics. The media was shown to be corrupt early on so anything reported there is suspect at best.

My position remains.


Eck!

BadTux said...

And one thing I'll point out, for those saying "why are we talking so much about Zimmerman when *both* did stupid things?" -- Z-man is an adult. Martin was a teenager. Teenagers do stupid things. That's a reality. But adults are supposed to behave like adults. Z-man behaved like a testosterone-crazed immature teenager intent upon proving his cojones, rather than like an adult, so yes, he *does* get an extra helping of blame for the fact that a young man is dead and his own life ruined. Is this fair? Not really, but neither is life, and when you don't live up to your obligations as an adult, you *will* come in for an extra helping of blame at the end of the day.

- BT