tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post1126452158968932296..comments2024-03-28T23:33:45.139-04:00Comments on Just An Earth-Bound Misfit, I : Trump Boils the Frog and the Good Little Americans Say NothingComrade Misfithttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15404477636451308763noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-85778558646273607642018-06-23T10:06:10.252-04:002018-06-23T10:06:10.252-04:00Sorry, forgot:
The pictures of the detention from...Sorry, forgot:<br /><br />The pictures of the detention from the Obama administration were different in that the parents and children were together then, rather than being torn apart, that’s the difference in the outrage.CenterPuke88https://www.blogger.com/profile/17770056621255249861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-50018376672642677152018-06-23T10:04:29.244-04:002018-06-23T10:04:29.244-04:00Let us count the ways some of the above statements...Let us count the ways some of the above statements are wrong:<br /><br />There is an absolute right, in U.S. law, to cross the border and request asylum. It is NOT limited to a specific location(s).<br /><br />There is a reason the Obama administration released for return, and its called the fact that some places are setting court dates 3 or 4 years into the future for Administrative hearings. Until the hearing is held, under this little piece of paper called the U.S. Constitution, continued detention has been held to be unreasonable for such a length of time.<br /><br />If they disappear and work, how are we “house and feed(ing) them”?<br /><br />Donnie’s latest Executive Order is in violation of a Court Order due to Sessions direction to charge first time offenders, on the southern border only, with a criminal act versus an administrative violation. This then causes inprisonment versus detention, and yes it is different.<br /><br />The CBP has already begun releasing border crossers WITHOUT prosecuting, and instead gong back to the old policy, because they have no place to stack the bodies. This has resulted in conflict in the White House.CenterPuke88https://www.blogger.com/profile/17770056621255249861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-40394146919549399822018-06-22T15:01:28.568-04:002018-06-22T15:01:28.568-04:00http://thehill.com/opinion/immigration/390743-peop...http://thehill.com/opinion/immigration/390743-people-fleeing-persecution-have-the-right-to-seek-asylum<br /><br />A concise summary of right to seek asylum. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-50167249185059256852018-06-22T14:53:36.046-04:002018-06-22T14:53:36.046-04:00https://www.juancole.com/2018/06/refugee-morally-i...https://www.juancole.com/2018/06/refugee-morally-illegal.html<br /><br />Sessions is breaking the law. And then there is transporting minors across state lines without parental permission which may violate the Mann Act. Let the prosecutions begin.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-49194275905819453552018-06-22T14:35:09.792-04:002018-06-22T14:35:09.792-04:00Link to U.S. Asylum Codes:
https://www.law.cornel...Link to U.S. Asylum Codes:<br /><br />https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/8/1158<br /><br />Long, but very interesting read. The Trump Administration and DOJ are ignoring and twisting existing U.S. codes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-74072289867632869692018-06-20T19:50:22.583-04:002018-06-20T19:50:22.583-04:00For the better part of two decades 80-85% of peopl...For the better part of two decades 80-85% of people polled supported immigration reform. Right, Left, business, worker bees whatever. You would think that would be a no brainer for Congress? In one sense this is just deck chairs on the Titanic. Every Congress-critter seems to be allergic to the greatest good. It's why small winning coalitions is always bad for the peoples. https://www.amazon.com/Dictators-Handbook-Behavior-Almost-Politics/dp/1610391845/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1529538313&sr=8-1&keywords=dictators+handbook&dpID=51t8ojwHg3L&preST=_SY291_BO1,204,203,200_QL40_&dpSrc=srch<br /><br />After the Civil War, the North advanced faster than the South due to larger winning coalitions. The science part is on page 265. Jones, Jon Joneshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09156079859977989586noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-54239448199862034212018-06-20T11:57:55.916-04:002018-06-20T11:57:55.916-04:00AC2usn, These individuals are not breaking the l...AC2usn, These individuals are not breaking the law. They are turning themselves into authorities and asking for asylum. Instead of "catch and release" we are enforcing detention. We are only enforcing this provision (option) on our southern border. The easiest and most common way to become an illegal alien is to over stay a vise (work, student, tourist, etc). In the Boston metro area the Irish are the largest number of illegal aliens.<br /><br /><br />We are citizens of the greatest country in the world. We are currently lead (??) by god knows what,<br /><br /><br /><br />AC2usn <br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />in an AC2usnnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-51591420042653440582018-06-20T11:29:15.959-04:002018-06-20T11:29:15.959-04:00Specifically, the GOP bills up for consideration i...Specifically, the GOP bills up for consideration in the House and Senate would dramatically cut the time immigrants have to present their bids for asylum. The version drafted by Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX), for example, mandates the hiring of thousands of new immigration judges who must hear families’ cases within 14 days of them crossing the border.<br /><br />“The whole purpose of this is to adjudicate their claims very quickly and make a determination whether they have a valid asylum claim or if they can be deported,” Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI), who supports a bill from Sen. John Cornyn (R-TX), told TPM.<br /><br />Human rights advocates say the two-week timeline would make it nearly impossible for asylum-seekers to put together the evidence needed for a successful application, especially since the families are being held in remote facilities where access to lawyers is difficult.<br /><br />https://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/gop-bills-to-lock-up-families-together-are-fulfilling-the-trump-admins-wishes<br /><br />But the Democrats are being ‘partisan’.Dark Avengerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02220642215040873632noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-38326858500453478582018-06-20T11:15:28.118-04:002018-06-20T11:15:28.118-04:00“Democrats insist Trump could end the policy on hi...“Democrats insist Trump could end the policy on his own, and every Senate Democrat has backed a proposal by Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.) to stop the family separation. Republican leaders, meanwhile, are working on their own bill. But there hasn’t been much bipartisanship. “With both parties largely entrenched, centrist senators are increasingly worried that there will be rival partisan ‘fixes’ to ending the crisis -- with no give from either side that can lead to 60 votes in the Senate,” they write. For their part, moderate senators are beginning preliminary talks. But they have no bill or consensus on how broadly to go.”<br /><br /><br />https://politi.co/2MIeCBV<br /><br />The Washington Examiner is a partisan fishwrap.Dark Avengerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02220642215040873632noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-91716564994975786292018-06-20T10:57:24.440-04:002018-06-20T10:57:24.440-04:00Isn't it Congress' duty to enact legislati...Isn't it Congress' duty to enact legislation? They tried, but the Dems voted no.<br /><br />https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/congress/senate-democrats-reject-gop-legislative-fix-to-stop-family-separations<br /><br />Jim in Monroe<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-73259276182608714592018-06-20T10:12:56.813-04:002018-06-20T10:12:56.813-04:00Its not about what obama did or Bush(es) did. hist...Its not about what obama did or Bush(es) did. history is hard to accpet but its also unchangeable.<br /><br />Its about what is the current president going to do about it. He has the power to act and is if only by inaction guilty of doing worse.<br /><br />As to the people coming in. Its my understanding that at the border they <br />are applying then and there for asylum and then being separated as criminals <br />before they are granted or denied. <br /><br />Is that fair? <br />Is that due process? <br />Is that humane?<br /><br />I can't even be rational about our immigration policies. I've seen too much<br />up close to know it is seriously screwed up.<br /><br />Until we fix this we have no say in the works how other countries behave. None!<br /><br /><br />Eck!Eck!https://www.blogger.com/profile/13890237094647111653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-4081920703267657982018-06-20T09:42:29.940-04:002018-06-20T09:42:29.940-04:00Here are pictures from Obama's era. Why no ou...Here are pictures from Obama's era. Why no outrage then?<br />http://dailycaller.com/2018/06/19/photos-obama-immigration-detention-facilities/<br /><br />Jim in MonroeAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-91065775639491702992018-06-20T03:13:15.511-04:002018-06-20T03:13:15.511-04:00"If someone was arrested without probable cau..."If someone was arrested without probable cause to believe they had broken a law, they should sue under 1983. Damage quantum for the child separation alone should send a message and it is, at least initially, borne by the individual who performed the arrest. (Insurance and department policy then step in.) There should absolutely be no tearing families apart when they've broken no laws; there should be no arrests of lone individuals without families when they've broken no laws. Are you saying this has happened? And gone unaddressed?"<br /><br /> Tell that to the Congolese woman who is still incarcerated in San Diego while her daughter is being held in Chicago. She applied for asylum at a port of entry, just like Sessions said she should, and she hasn't seen her daughter for months.<br /> Do you really believe she has the resources to file a lawsuit?<br /><br /> -Doug in Oaklanddinthebeasthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12941071534250216503noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-76415775687829505532018-06-20T03:07:14.357-04:002018-06-20T03:07:14.357-04:00Well, B, here in Oakland we have found that they d... Well, B, here in Oakland we have found that they don't need much "housing and feeding" at all. In fact, they are participating members of our community who pay their own way, and since they aren't citizens, pay taxes into programs they'll never collect from.<br /><br /> This sure has knocked all of the new developments in the Mueller probe off of the front page right as the midterms get underway, while inflaming the prejudices of the most hard core of the Republican base.<br /><br /> -Doug in Oakland dinthebeasthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12941071534250216503noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-35787318165118553872018-06-19T23:58:09.000-04:002018-06-19T23:58:09.000-04:00Y'all seem to feel that these parents have eve...Y'all seem to feel that these parents have every right to enter our country. <br /><br />They don't. <br /><br />They ahve no right to cross our borders. And. when caught, it is no longer unreasonable to consider that they might show up for the court hearing, but will, instead, vanish int out country and work and live illegally. <br /><br />The fact that Barry allowed them to do so does not mean that Trump should. <br /><br />Again, if y'all want to house and feed these people, feel free to sponsor them for immigration. I see a bunch of folks decrying the upholding of the laws. I don't see you helping these folks IN fact, all I see is a bunch of folks reacting to a bunch of news stories and hating on Trump. <br /><br />When are you going to start sponsoring immigrants, housing them, feeding and clothing them, etc? Or are y'all just Hypocrites?<br />Put up or shut upB https://www.blogger.com/profile/10586046436233366155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-55253364508653842892018-06-19T20:37:23.593-04:002018-06-19T20:37:23.593-04:00Bradley,
You asked for my ideas on immigration an...Bradley,<br /><br />You asked for my ideas on immigration and then ignored what I provided. I do wonder why (no I don't - I'm being snarky here).<br /><br />I brought up traffic violations because that's the easiest to define when a person tells me they just want the laws on the books to be upheld. Funny how you had all kinds of conditions as to why Certain People are shot more than others at routine traffic stops. Evidence backs me up - white folks have privileges that others do not. That's not equal enforcement under the law - just saying.<br /><br />As for asylum posts being closed, it is standard operating procedure for an abusive regime to restrict access; it's historical. Once the public settles on the treatment of the immigrant population the regimes next move is to detain other undesirables - for the good of the nation of course. <br /><br />Regarding convictions, I'm fond of For the Good of All and May it Harm None.<br /><br />I'm seeing harm done in the here/now and the fact you can ignore it means I'm deleriously glad we don't share convictions.Grey One talks sassnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-77817518976952456872018-06-19T20:02:35.552-04:002018-06-19T20:02:35.552-04:00First, I agree with you totally. The obvious solut...First, I agree with you totally. The obvious solution is compounds with parent and kids. Let's call the internment camps, shall we. But this wasn't the first. The first was "Lock her up." This is a deeply ingrained mentality.Doug T.https://www.blogger.com/profile/05696951503327566895noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-11368922158952770542018-06-19T18:55:53.307-04:002018-06-19T18:55:53.307-04:00Grey One, thank you for the response.
I figure th...Grey One, thank you for the response.<br /><br />I figure the Declaration of Independence for an articulation of natural law, but I'll admit that's rather subjective.<br /><br />Traffic violations are, by my understanding, a lesser class than misdemeanor. But I'd support arresting white folks (and anyone else) whose behavior indicated that their response to the issuance of a speeding ticket would be driving off at 90MPH and a subsequent failure to appear on the court date. I would cheer it. I would condemn allowing someone to keep speeding because they had a child in the car, and were the only available caretaker. I would consider such inaction by the police to be either an indication of a fundamental absence of resolve, or a tacit admission that the laws they were hired to enforce were illegitimate. I consider those to be analogous, at least for those points. Do you think them not analogous, or perhaps have a different opinion on them?<br /><br />Closing down asylum stations is new to me. My initial thought is that any station that could be reached legally ought to have been kept open. Entering "where they can" makes me wonder if that condition is met. But if it was, then what the government's done is back themselves into a corner for a false arrest.<br /><br />If someone was arrested without probable cause to believe they had broken a law, they should sue under 1983. Damage quantum for the child separation alone should send a message and it is, at least initially, borne by the individual who performed the arrest. (Insurance and department policy then step in.) There should absolutely be no tearing families apart when they've broken no laws; there should be no arrests of lone individuals without families when they've broken no laws. Are you saying this has happened? And gone unaddressed?<br /><br />Whether or not bigotry or prejudice are present on Trump's part, the zero tolerance policy is, in my view, necessary to enforce the law. That's enough to warrant its implementation, his possible personal sins notwithstanding. I'm agreeing with enforcing the law, and I'm not going to resist it based on an uncharitable inference of one man's bigotry, or even to thwart a wicked man who is doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. I've not purported to fear a monster. I sleep at night because I act consistent with my convictions. That you do not share them does not make them less compelling to me.B Phttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02816788270198820684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-60637002719363608402018-06-19T17:53:38.347-04:002018-06-19T17:53:38.347-04:00I was asked - "The Constitution says nothing ...I was asked - "The Constitution says nothing on the subject. You're perhaps stating natural law."<br /><br />The idea is in the Declaration of Independence, not the Constitution. My bad. And Natural Law is neither.<br /><br />Generally I was also asked "Would anyone in opposition to the new zero tolerance policy like to state their preference that no misdemeanor offense be prosecuted, or even stopped, if doing so would leave a child without a non-government caretaker?"<br /><br />I regularly see folks disobeying traffic laws - I'd love to see Zero Tolerance when it comes to white folks on that subject. As for those who request asylum - the families are allowed by law to request asylum. The Border Patrol as I've heard it have closed down those stations where asylum can be requested so they enter where they can and take care of the paperwork later. Tearing families apart is not necessary for people who HAVE NOT BROKEN ANY OF THE USA'S LAWS. Is that clear enough?<br /><br />As for immigration - I want work visas for everyone so anyone can work wherever an employer needs an employee. Taxes are accrued based on the country where the work is performed. Seems like logic to me but then I'm a win/win kind of person.<br /><br />In my opinion the only reason the zero tolerance policy is in effect is bigotry and prejudice, and those who support such cruelty must own it. By not resisting you are agreeing and by agreeing you become the monster you purport to fear. I honestly don't know how you sleep at night.Grey One talks sassnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-43178192750704655072018-06-19T17:45:10.430-04:002018-06-19T17:45:10.430-04:00If the "main argument" is "separati...If the "main argument" is "separating children from their parents" then *the* thing that the other side isn't understanding cannot be how bad our immigration policies affect people who follow them. Missing that point wouldn't affect reasoning on the "main argument" as you stated it.B Phttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02816788270198820684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-80148333844634342462018-06-19T17:41:50.540-04:002018-06-19T17:41:50.540-04:00Motte: All of the tactics were to deflect from the...Motte: All of the tactics were to deflect from the main argument of separating children from their parents.<br /><br />Bailey (with bonus ad hominem & Godwin's law): What these closed minded, Nazis wrapped in the American flag can't understand is that if "they" do follow the procedure, their lives and their children's lives will be over prior to any decision made on the status of their request to emigrate. The attitude of "sucks to be them" is prevalent on the right, where they present a complete lack of empathy for anyone from another country.<br /><br />You want immigration reform. You're arguing for it in an improper manner.B Phttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02816788270198820684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-85650635006749810132018-06-19T17:36:31.396-04:002018-06-19T17:36:31.396-04:00Misfit, I ask again: Leave the kids unattended whe...Misfit, I ask again: Leave the kids unattended wherever their parents were arrested. No more camps. Sound preferable to anyone?<br /><br />If I ever have kids, I fully expect to be able to tell them that, should I commit crimes, that I will be locked up for it - even for minor ones, should it be apparent that I will ignore the summons. And that, should their mother do the same, she'll be treated the same. And that if we both do it, and there is no one else to take care of them, that they'll become wards of the state for the duration. And that the state will probably suck at the job.<br /><br />And I'll be able to tell them that there isn't a damn thing wrong with that. (Except the state sucking at the job, but that's only partially fixable.) Because the alternative is letting criminals hide behind their children's welfare while still in the act of the crime. In the present context, it's one step worse: the arrested parents are the ones who isolated the child from any potential caretakers who would not be subject to arrest. They cannot be allowed to plead that self-created exigency as a defense against arrest.<br /><br />I'll also hope that, at some point, they'd be able to understand that fair and uniform application of that rule to a large group of lawbreakers who are the only caretakers of their children would result in large numbers of wards of the state, and that, if they outstripped current capacity, would require new lodgings. But maybe they'd never mature sufficiently to see that past an obstructing emotional haze.<br /><br />I'm on board with fixing the care for children in the custody of the government. However, what I've been seeing is the employment of motte and bailey tactics, with a motte of how the children are being taken care of (or not) and a bailey of enabling rampant and ongoing criminal behavior. A motte of stopping child brutality, and a bailey of lawlessness.<br /><br />And I'm not taking the motte's factual basis on faith. I've seen instances of the left asking for condemnation of bad behavior, then using that as the sole evidence that the bad behavior occurred. My sense of trust has suffered.<br /><br />I'm fine with taking parents away from kids - and that is the correct characterization - for a misdemeanor if there is good reason to believe that they will not show up to court if a summons is issued in lieu of arrest. Doubly so if there is good reason to think that they'll continue to commit that misdemeanor if not arrested. Both are the case here. I am fine with this regardless of whether the arrested parent is American. And if that leaves a kid without a caretaker, there really isn't much choice. As I understand it, there is a jurisprudential rule that the kid can't come along to the parent's jail. I don't know whether that's a bad rule, but it is presently the rule. So, kids alone on the street. Take them or leave them. See Happy Meals, supra.<br /><br />Perhaps I'm asking the wrong question of my opposition. Would anyone in opposition to the new zero tolerance policy like to state their preference that no misdemeanor offense be prosecuted, or even stopped, if doing so would leave a child without a non-government caretaker?B Phttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02816788270198820684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-68927267027977053332018-06-19T17:36:14.892-04:002018-06-19T17:36:14.892-04:00Comrade, I opined repeatedly on another blog about...Comrade, I opined repeatedly on another blog about the repugnant separation of children from their parents, which I find reprehensible. Every response was along the lines of "Well, if they didn't break the law..." or "They should follow the rules..." Either that or "Are you willing to pay for them or house them?" All of the tactics were to deflect from the main argument of separating children from their parents. <br /><br />What these closed minded, Nazis wrapped in the American flag can't understand is that if "they" do follow the procedure, their lives and their children's lives will be over prior to any decision made on the status of their request to emigrate. The attitude of "sucks to be them" is prevalent on the right, where they present a complete lack of empathy for anyone from another country.<br /><br />If anything, THAT is sad.<br /><br />DaleDTWNDhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10874818524204797652noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-69761134516371120272018-06-19T17:12:57.295-04:002018-06-19T17:12:57.295-04:00we weren't doing it, at least in these numbers...we weren't doing it, at least in these numbers, before.<br /><br />So why now?<br /><br />Trump's been clear that this is a negotiating ploy so that he can get money for his wall. He is taking kids from their parents to pressure Congress to do things his way. That's about as reprehensible as it gets.Comrade Misfithttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15404477636451308763noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7924773307171301256.post-64069520137123496822018-06-19T16:29:23.839-04:002018-06-19T16:29:23.839-04:00"We're taking kids away from parents for ..."We're taking kids away from parents for a misdemeanor. You're fine with that?"<br /><br />What alternative is there? Just release the kids, let em free roam? Do we give coupons for a few Happy Meals?New Jovian Thunderbolthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09452246769246304612noreply@blogger.com